Melissa Etheridge’s wife, Tammy Lynn Michaels, writes the HollywoodFarmGirl blog.
This week, she has an entry about Melissa meeting Pastor Rick Warren [Tammy says Rick was ‘humble and kind.’] And Tammy argues that gays should “settle for civil unions” ….
I agree with Tammy Lynn. With a nod, nod and a wink, wink we can out fox the conservatives. This is playing the political system and it’s done every day on the Hill. Compromise over the language and seize the rights.
Is anyone else out there tired of expecting celebrities and celebrity-wannabes make our arguments for us?
How interesting. Apparently Queers can convince an Oklahoma Southern Baptist, Kristin Chenoweth, that we deserve the same treatment under the law as everyone else but we’re still having problems with elite Queers.
At least as far as I know Elton John has never made such slimey comments such as those made by Etheridge when talking about how lovely Warren is. Through their support of back-of-the-bus civil unions it looks as though this bunch of homos is more eager to placate their friends in powerful positions rather than demand first class citizenship.
These people’s positions and statements remind me of Booker T Washington’s advocation of separate but “equal”. While we can look back upon history now and realize that this sort of treatment with minority groups is failed, Washington was too busy rubbing elbows with the Carnegies and Rockefellers to understand the importance of such issues. Your everyday African American or Gay feels the sting of inequality so much more than those that supposedly represent us in public.
In the end, sure, civil unions would be a huge step forward in getting our civil rights, but it would only be that, a step. The Gay and Lesbian civil rights movement has got to demand full equality and protection under the law, name included. Anything else would be selling ourselves short.
Jon
I am. The only celebrity I care to hear from is Patti Smith.
I agree with Blake. The reason the gay-rights movement doesn’t have a leader is because we’ve invested entirely too much interest in what the celebrity-of-the-moment has to say. We can’t count on Rosie or Ellen or Melissa or Elton to lead our movement. We need another massive march on Washington!
Blake do you believe in the government of this country? if not tell us why. And do you vote? If not tell us why.
We are talking about issues that will change if we got out and voted along with introducing legislation to change the laws that govern us as a people. I am curious what your position ion that?.
We will win this struggle in small steps and we need to be prepared to pay what ever price that need to be paid for all of us, not just a group of us. Blake are you willing to pay the price or just talk about it?
Michael, although voting and my “belief” in the government are only connected to the topic at hand in a very roundabout way I will go ahead and humor you and respond to your red herring.
You asked three questions and I will respond to each of them in turn. First, do I believe in the government of this country? By “believe in” I assume you are asking if I think the US government is good. Just like any other free thinking individual that hasn’t been totally consumed by nationalistic hype I do think that there are “good” elements of the government, and of course there are “bad” elements of the government. By good and bad I mean societal mechanisms that provide for or deprive people from living full and meaningful lives. I rarely make such bold statements but you have got to be a damn fool to view the world with such a Manichean perspective.
The second question, do I vote? I generally do vote when it’s not a huge inconvenience to do so, which was typically the case while I was living in Spain. Again I’m going to be so bold as to pose the question which I think you meant to ask in the first place and that is whether I think voting is useful to create social change. It’s such a huge and complex question so let’s just look at the US in the last 200 and some odd years. In this context I don’t think that voting has been the primary agent of social change. I think that the voting booth is largely used as a cooling device intended to deter people from participating in independent political activities and organizations. I think that long term change in the US comes from these independent organizations and movements. Because I don’t want to write my dissertation on the Instant Tea blog, I am of course speaking very generally.
And lastly, if I am willing to pay “the” price or just talk about “it”. Again, I don’t know exactly what you mean but I can venture a guess. I imagine you are asking if I am willing dedicate myself to the LGBT civil rights movement. The short answer would be I absolutely am. I dedicate a considerable amount of time working towards building what I believe very much is a very effective way of attaining our civil rights. I not only do all of this for free but I have also spent my own money to meet these ends. That’s all I will go into on my level of dedication, I think other aspects are a bit personal. In the end I don’t feel as though I have to defend my level of dedication to anyone and I honestly think it’s quite sleazy of you to raise that question.
Michael, unless you can keep to the topic and ask a relevant and respectful question I’m not going to respond anymore to your petty little comments whose only intent is defamation.
Kris…. I completely agree. I am still trying to swallow Melissa ‘hugging on’ Warren and her recent press statement.. but agree with the principle… just waiting to get past the emotion MLE being one of the first to come out so publicly for Warren (she’s my hero). I guess Deepak has had an incredible influence on her…. have to check that out a little deeper to see what it’s all about. Maye it will rub off.
Rain drops on roses and whisker on kittens…OH! Hello! It’s Li’l Carl again! These “civil unions” could start a chain of events leading up to a fully recognized marriage. I’m all about getting married to a tall, strapping baby daddy….however, we need to take things one day at a time. As mentioned in previous comments…a march in D.C. would be awesome. I’m all about festive signs and colors with some fabulous homo brothers!
Actually, Jon and Blake,
Respectfully, the reason we do not have a leader is not due to what the ‘celebrity of the moment’ has to say. It is that when people DO step up to lead, we attack them because we don’t agree 100% with them instead of supporting their efforts because we ourselves don’t have the presence they bring to the table to get more people to listen to us. Then it is like a wolf pack attack and that person leaves. Another steps up with thought and actions, then they are attacked because, again, we don’t agree with one sentence of what they say.
We can’t even agree in blogs – how in the heck are we to agree where it really matters… in public?
Well, it just seems to me that the more all of these issues are kept alive, spoken about and demonstrated, by individuals and couples. the more likely we will achieve what we have set out to do, Change an archaic law.my partner and i have a 33 year relationship.We have survived all the suppression. and advancement in this long journey, we have enjoyed as our lives.
Can i say there is room for improvement ,absolutely,will it happen ,absolutely.Everyday I ,We have a chance to show how committed we are to each other, and to the advancement of equal rights.I say take any and all we can get .The saying goes a long journey starts with the first step , and i am here to tell you this has been a long journey from when i first realized in the sixties that iwas who i am.Take all you can and reap the benefits and call it by whatever name you want .civil union at least gives me the rights of decision and finacial. marriage ,is a religious ceremony , that should be celebrated ,in the church of your choice and has nothing to really do with the issue at hand .WHAT”S IN A NAME?
There was a time when I advocated a complete separation of civil unions and marriages, much like the situation in France, where civil unions are regulated by the state and marriages are regulated by the churches. But my partner and I believe we have something more than a civil union…something more than a contractual relationship. We believe we have a marriage…a covenant and a contract. The idea of a covenantal relationship — an exclusive, lifelong commitment — isn’t strictly a religious one and therefore shouldn’t be ceded to the churches.
As for your comment, Etta, I truly regret that your efforts were thwarted by rancor, suspicion and hostility. It seems that leaders have to posses a crocodile-like skin in order to get anything accomplished. My lack thereof is precisely why I don’t take on more of a mantle of leadership.
Etta I agree,
Until we as a community of gay people speaks together in one voice the fight remains between us not at those who want to see us dead. https://www.adl.org/default.htm
I will always advocate for those who are afraid to stand up and for those who believe in fighting for our rights. People who are afraid, they will find the strength by example and we are not leaving them a very good one when we publicly attack each other Blake and Jon.
That is NOT what being an advocate is about, advocating is about fighting for the community she or he is a part of to make it better. Let’s bring ALL of our ideas to the table and build a strong force together.
Harvey Milk showed us that even iwhen some groups in the gay community would not see the big picture. If we continue to be selfish and self centered and let our ego’s dictate the direction of advocacy our opposition will surely win and we won’t know why.
It doesn’t surprise me that Etta and Michael agree on this. It seems as though they would like us to march blindly behind our “leaders” and if we have a difference of opinion we should just shut up and move on.
First of all, clowns like Etheridge, Elton John, et al… don’t represent the majority of Gays and Lesbians who are working class and for marriage equality.
Secondly, given that the US flag has been used quite a bit in their events, Etta even had an ode to old glory on her lapel on Nov 15 if I remember correctly, you would think that these two would advocate democracy like the flag supposedly represents. Well, following the dictums of Our Dear Leader without any questioning doesn’t sound a whole lot like democracy to me. After all, this is politics and democracy only makes our tactics and our arguments that much stronger. So how bout the both of y’all stop playing the poor woe-is-me victim and realize that questioning and critique of politics aren’t some sort of personal attack.
Hell, Michael even has a sentence above that would suggest that he agrees with me, “let’s bring all of our ideas to the table”… But he contradicts himself by saying, “until we as a community of gay people speakS together”… Is it that you actually don’t know what you’re talking about Michael or is it that you actually do think that we should all come together but only as long as all the ideas coming together at the table are exactly the same?
Oh my gawd! Oh my gawd! Someone arrest me for having worn an American Flag lapel pin. OH MY GAWD! Seriously? A lapel pin? Seriously? ::scratches head:: Again, SERIOUSLY?
Blake, there is constructive criticism and then there is attacking. Constructive would be saying “please save a march for another event we don’t have time to organize that in 4 days” – attacking is criticizing someone for wearing a lapel pin. My family has fought and many have died for “Old Glory” so you have the freedom to spout every one of your words. I wear it often and will continue to do so whenever the hell I want to–never to apologize for it.
Just because you don’t believe in democracy or other things this country represents doesn’t mean that any of us have to listen to you insult those of us who do.
As for “criticizing” Michael for saying what he thinks, when in reality he was really trying to AGREE with you. Is this really how you gain SUPPORT?
I have left JTI. I have left the community. Stop the blogs – all over the internet (not just here) stop all of this crap.
BACK OFF. I HAVE HAD ENOUGH !! For God’s sake you ass, you damn well know my mother in law is dying– have you no cuth? LEAVE ME ALONE!
The post in question surrounds giving the LGBT community the right to marry and the same laws afforded those who currently enjoy the covenant of marriage including federal and state laws, citing both the introduction on this page as well as the reference to Tammy’s bog specifically. The only difference, as expressed by Tammy Etheridge, is a few letters in the alphabet. I do agree with Tammy’s presentation of a solution and how is that a bad thing since her proposed outcome affords our community the right to marry with the equality of the laws? If calling it a union allows me to legally marry my beloved and it would be recognized with the 1100+ laws afforded to legally coupled persons within the borders of the USA, who am I to decline that? Does that mean I believe I should settle for something less than my hetero neighbor? NO. However, I would rather concede temporarily a word to get the right than to not have the opportunity at all, as is the current case. In no way does that make me asking or blindly marching behind anyone. The proposed solution is an incremental gain, as Jon references above, one step closer to the goal of true equality. We are not going to obtain our rights with an ‘all or nothing’ dictum such as it appears you are advocating for. That however is speculation on my part and in no way, shape or form decries your opinion.
Tammy discusses a foot-in-the-door solution to obtain our rights within the current temperment of our society, since the biggest obstacle is over the word marriage. Marriage is not a religious ceremony, nor a word owned by anyone despite attempts by the religiously inclined. Down the road, courts would determine the two are in actuality the same and it would be called marriage for all. This concept collides with what some opponents would allow us with ‘civil unions’ – a separate type of union without legally protective rights. Therefore, it is my summation that Tammy is calling for a temporary compromise, gaining our right and we suffer in our legal unions while being legally joined and protected under the word “union†for the short term. This after all is how the Civil Rights movement was successful: incrementally. With each generation comes a more temporal attitude change as evidenced in the voting breakdown of Prop 8 in California. A larger demographic divide was among the youth, who overwhelmingly voted against Prop 8 while elder generations voted Yes on 8.
Looking globally to solutions for our problems in the USA, are Great Britain and France, which Jon mentioned. Great Britain has marriage, a religious ceremony and civil unions for those who either want the legality or are unable to marry within the confines of a church such as the case was with Prince Charles who could not remarry since he divorced Diana. To the best of my knowledge, both Elton and Charles are given the same legal protections under their law, thus in essence, a closer example of what Tammy is advocating here. France, as it was explained to me recently, requires a civil union prior to any religious ceremony. Therefore, those who want to have their relationship blessed in the presence of their God may do so only as a second step, not an isolated ceremony in a church or place of worship. I am not so sure the US is ready to follow in the steps of the French, but only my opinion.
You are entitled to your opinion as you state “clowns like Etheridge, Elton John, et al†however I don’t subscribe to that intolerance just because they live in a higher tax bracket. Those clowns as you call them, while different than say a waitress in a local café, do participate in the community and society of which they are part. Look at Elton John’s international non-profits. Melissa Etheridge has several of her own and champions viewpoints of which I personally believe in and have no problem defending to the likes of your thinking. Peace in our world would resolve so many current obstacles and is something we should collectively strive for. This is not to say I do not question or blindly follow her ideas just because they come from her. I do my research. I try the idea on like a new hat to see how it feels in my gut and how it works with my own views and then make a determination based on what works for me. I am not however trying to shove my belief down your throat until you accept my way of thinking. It is also not to say peace is the only solution to our problems globally, however while we are out in the streets and raising our voices, why can we not ask for a truce to all the division in the world. Are we unable to multi-task while still prioritizing our bottom line goals?
I also unapologetically advocate democracy, especially when it resembles the definition here by Merriam-Webster, “a government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised by them directly or indirectly through a system of representation usually involving periodically held free elections.†I unapologetically believe in the United States of America and the flag which has represented our wonderful country for over 2 centuries. With that said, that does not mean I agree blindly or wholeheartedly with each and every policy, statement, rule, law or grievance in the land, nor does make me a moving target for your rifle sites. I believe in change. I believe in personal and societal growth and growth comes from change. Change comes when a different point of view resonates with another person and they buy into the idea which is new to that person or now seen in a different light. Shock value has a place as does consistent calm reprogramming. Change in essence, is reprogramming by introducing new concepts to the existing ideals or actions which an individual or a society has held as the traditionally accepted view. That is such the case as we have today.
As for your “stop playing the poor woe-is-me victim and realize that questioning and critique of politics aren’t some sort of personal attack†statement. You have repeatedly stated opinions which you claim are mine, expanded upon blips of a statement without any substance nor context to which the statement was made—or without the knowledge of the surrounding statements were as is the case with press articles. I am not the freaking enemy here. I am not the opponent. I am someone with whom you should want to have support you. The difference would be wise to learn but I am sure you have some strategic plan that incorporates victims of your wrath, such as myself, as collateral damage that will in turn win over the masses of our community to your side. Brilliant.
In the same spirit as your previous statements of me born out of my disagreement with your request to hold a march at ONE event, here is my critique of your politics. With your extreme superior intellect, mindreading ability, and extensive activism experience surpassing those who have been championing our rights for longer than your short 27 years of existence, I am disappointed that we are still fighting for our rights under your “leadershipâ€. After all, you have all the answers and therefore should have a long list of successful accomplishments by now. Nothing personal, right?
Now, in light of this consistent barrage of crap you enjoy flinging in my direction like a monkey in a zoo when someone passes by because otherwise no one would pay attention to you, can you please put a diaper on and keep the shit to yourself and get back to what we ALL want accomplished— winning our rights?
Etta – honey, nobody is attacking you. Yes, Blake and I disagree with your “leadership” style, but thankfully, you have resigned from JTI. (Though the circumstances for which are very tragic. I said a prayer for your family.)
I must say, Etta, when it comes to suffering, you’re right up there with Elizabeth Taylor. (anybody get the reference?) The day I first met you, you had just been stung by a bee. You mentioned it 4 times in the conversation. I felt so bad! Then, the second time I talked to you, you were experiencing an excruciating migraine. You must have mentioned it 4 times. (You sure were a trooper, though. If I had been experiencing a migraine as hard core as you claimed you were, I wouldn’t have had the strength to bee-bop to the music the way you occasionally did) I just feel so bad that your entire life is one big, sad, bad thing after another. If it isn’t a bee sting, it’s a migraine. And now, you have two twenty-something-year-olds (you sure love mentioning our age, doncha?) disagreeing with your leadership methods. I’m not sure why you have turned our disagreements into a personal attack on you. Perhaps playing a victim just comes naturally to you. It certainly seems like it. Just sayin.
I’m very sorry for your situation with your family, and again, I have prayed to the Goddess for you. Having said that, I am SO glad you left JTI. You just weren’t cut out for it. (Don’t let the door hit ya, gurl!) 😉
By the way – a very close loved one of mine recently died. I’m not telling you for sympathy, I don’t need it. I just want to help you understand that everyone has pain and everyone has suffering…not just Etta and Elizabeth Taylor. If your pain is so great that you’re unable to communicate on these blogs without going in to your dark place and accusing us of not having “cuth” just because we dared disagree while you were in pain, then I suggest, for your own sake gurl, stay away from these blogs and conversations for awhile. And take a Xanax! Bless your heart, you’ve needed one from the day I met you.
Gabe,
I am not interested in your style of friendship, love, prayers or anything else. With friends like you, I need no enemies. It is ashame that you take so much time attacking someone within the community for such personal issues– now you are criticizing how I act when I have a migraine?? You must be a doctor too!?!?! How about focusing your energy on making new allies, and gain support for the community’s issues rather than detract from them.
Recently you and Blake openly called for “unity” and asked other established and seasoned leadership to have open conversations and join forces with you. Do you honestly believe that this is the way to gain anyone’s trust to come together with you? They are witnessing in public what would happen to them if they disagreed with the tag-team of Blake and Gabe. And nothing is out of bounds with you, further making my point of why I would never work with either of you.
By setting up unrealistic expectations in the 11th hour before an event, and then attacking someone’s leadership ability as evidence of your superior knowledge is not a reason that anyone should believe you have any abilities other than to hedge a bet.
Your ‘take a Xanax gurl-don’t let the door hit you-blah blah blah’ is truly tiresome. If you wish to actually discuss issues (issues such as what strategic plan do we as a community have to come together and use our collective voices in winning our rights), then it would be worth further time spent talking to you. You have shouted loudly that you have the answers, so let us all hear them and get to putting your plans seasoned with so much gusto that we will be enjoying marriages and equality here in Dallas before the new year is over.
Take your posts up a few notches and focus on what is truly important, and young lads, it is not me. With maturity, you will learn that your current game plan is completely ineffective and may prove to backfire if continued, if it has not yet already.
Remember, I am not leading anyone nor asking for anyone to follow me but you and Blake are. However I am looking to throw my money and support behind leaders I believe in. Whoops. That leaves you out.
Think before you hit the reply button Gabe.
i fully agree, with tammy… although i am from south africa. i do get the point, an hereby surport it
Wow…. You fags are touchy! Gabe is the reason poeple hate homos!